[Fencefry]

Meh, they'll completely fail it like they did with the release of the first one. You can get radios for the touch for around £15 though...

You apple people and always wanting to pay extra, huh.

If it turns out good I'll definitely consider buying it.

For a 360 owner, its a great item to have with the Live integration, but for at least the first few months the Touch will be better due to the app store (IMO).

Nothing better about it either. But most of the time my screen is off, so I don't get how having a more energy effecient screen would increase audio-playback?

We're talking about screens and battery as a pair here, I'm pretty sure they'll be on par with audio.

[Magical]

Why do I want the screen on in my pocket? The iPod screen is also bigger. Do we an accurate price yet? Last time apple changed their prices to make it lower than the Zun.

[Fencefry]

Why do I want the screen on in my pocket? The iPod screen is also bigger. Do we an accurate price yet? Last time apple changed their prices to make it lower than the Zun.

Wow, .2" inches bigger. And are you telling me you only use the Touch for audio? When you play games, watch videos, even use the menu it results in longer time to listen to auido with the screen off.

[Magical]

You go on about your quality being sharper, I'll go on about mine being bigger () I mean all I have on it is family guy and criminal minds, I don't need to have award-winning quality enhanced with Dolby digital premium sound...

And when am I going to use my iPod for more than 8 hours in one day?

[Falcon]

Well, I just laugh every time I see them try and "take-on" the iPod... - See?

This post has been edited by Falcon: May 27 2009, 06:36 PM

[Emo_Nemo]

You go on about your quality being sharper, I'll go on about mine being bigger () I mean all I have on it is family guy and criminal minds, I don't need to have award-winning quality enhanced with Dolby digital premium sound...

And when am I going to use my iPod for more than 8 hours in one day?

Why have a bigger screen if the clarity is not that great?

I mean its like someone having a 30inch screen that can't do full HD.

[Definition]

You go on about your quality being sharper, I'll go on about mine being bigger ( ) I mean all I have on it is family guy and criminal minds, I don't need to have award-winning quality enhanced with Dolby digital premium sound...

And when am I going to use my iPod for more than 8 hours in one day?

Who cares if it's bigger. It's still less innovative. If I have to sacrifice .2" off my screen for something more innovative such as an OLED screen, then that'll have to be a sacrifice I'd have to make.

Your fallacy is where you talk about how you use it. As a matter of fact, nobody cares the slightest about how you use your gadgets, at all. Nobody cares if you dim the backlight, or charge it 24/7 (even if charging it constantly can be a bad thing).

Apple and Microsoft don't cater to your needs, however they cater to the needs of a market in a whole.

The fact of the matter is that Apple is using yesterday's hardware technology, when Microsoft is using tomorrow's technologies.

The Zune is more energy-efficient, and lasts longer.

[Kaibamanjrs]

hopefully it has open application developement. I want to run some code on this.

[redmonke]

hopefully it has open application developement. I want to run some code on this.

I think even the first Zune was, but nobody developed for it.

[Kaibamanjrs]

hopefully it has open application developement. I want to run some code on this.

I think even the first Zune was, but nobody developed for it.

I have the first won and can only do games via the xna thing. I want to be able to do normal applications without some stupid developers program.

[Magical]

You go on about your quality being sharper, I'll go on about mine being bigger ( ) I mean all I have on it is family guy and criminal minds, I don't need to have award-winning quality enhanced with Dolby digital premium sound...

And when am I going to use my iPod for more than 8 hours in one day?

Who cares if it's bigger. It's still less innovative. If I have to sacrifice .2" off my screen for something more innovative such as an OLED screen, then that'll have to be a sacrifice I'd have to make.

And who cares if it has a sharper screen, it's really not going to make a difference on such a small screen, that was my point.

Your fallacy is where you talk about how you use it. As a matter of fact, nobody cares the slightest about how you use your gadgets, at all. Nobody cares if you dim the backlight, or charge it 24/7 (even if charging it constantly can be a bad thing).

If redmonke is saying it has all these features which makes it better, I'm saying that for people like myself, and probably 1000s of others out there, it own't make a difference. Mainly people who have a plug in their house.

Apple and Microsoft don't cater to your needs, however they cater to the needs of a market in a whole.

Apple caters to my needs, and so does Microsoft to an extent.

The fact of the matter is that Apple is using yesterday's hardware technology, when Microsoft is using tomorrow's technologies.

I understand that, and I'm saying unless they market it properly then it won't make a difference what technology they use. How many people in the market as a whole would understand what an OLED Screen is? They'll really need to plug the better battery and screen sharpness... But hey, there might be a new touch out by then anyway...

The Zune is more energy-efficient, and lasts longer.

I don't get how if you don't use the video, your audio-playback will in increase? And as I said, I don't believe many people will go 16 hours without having access to a charger.

[vausey]

But it's so nice to know statistically that I can use a Zune on an off (2 hours a day for when I transit around the place) and not have to charge it for 4 weeks

[Caboose]

Magical, you're just being obnoxious here. From what we've seen so far, (which, if i'm honest, isn't that much) this Zune will be better in almost every way than the iPod Touch. And you're saying that despite all of these features, it will fail because of a bad advertising campaign and it will still be worse than the iPod Touch... forgive me if i can't see your reasoning here, but dude...

It does make a difference on a smaller screen, trust me. I've got one, a 2.2" screen. I just changed from a 2.2" back lit LED MP3 player, and the quality and clarity is nothing short of amazing.

You're arguing that having less battery life is a worse thing... in no imaginable situation is that true. Just, dude... it's not.

They don't cater to your needs. They release products that will make them money. Fortunately for us, competition makes better, cheaper products. Better, cheaper products that we can buy.

This next point is difficult to interpret. You're saying that people won't know about it's superior screen due to bad advertising. Look, i understand hypothesizing but you've seen the absolute raw specifications of the device, nothing else. Your either a really big Apple fanboy or a severe pessimist, or doomsayer. Which one will it be?

Because you don't actually turn your screen off. You just dim the backlight, there's still power going to it.

And your point about not going a day without access to a charger, maybe not. But say, i'm a Zune owner... i have no need. Who would go out of their way to charge there device just to prove a point, dude you're just grasping at straws.

[redmonke]

I don't get how if you don't use the video, your audio-playback will in increase? And as I said, I don't believe many people will go 16 hours without having access to a charger.

Then don't use a Touch and use a Shuffle.

[Emo_Nemo]

I don't get how if you don't use the video, your audio-playback will in increase? And as I said, I don't believe many people will go 16 hours without having access to a charger.

Ever drive to Florida or California from a state like Michigan?

[redmonke]

I don't get how if you don't use the video, your audio-playback will in increase? And as I said, I don't believe many people will go 16 hours without having access to a charger.

Ever drive to Florida or California from a state like Michigan?

Exactly, you never know when you need extra battery life.

I drove from mid Texas to Georgia. Took around 20 hours (10 just to leave Texas). Driving from Canada to where I live takes about 25 hours, which I've done before (and so does the rest of my family ). I could be watching movies the whole ride down instead of having the screen off and only music playing.

[Caboose]

Or driving to Italy from Northern England... skiing trips ftw!

[Magical]

Magical, you're just being obnoxious here. From what we've seen so far, (which, if i'm honest, isn't that much) this Zune will be better in almost every way than the iPod Touch. And you're saying that despite all of these features, it will fail because of a bad advertising campaign and it will still be worse than the iPod Touch... forgive me if i can't see your reasoning here, but dude...

If you read my post; I did not say it would fail. I said if they do what they did last time it will fail.

It does make a difference on a smaller screen, trust me. I've got one, a 2.2" screen. I just changed from a 2.2" back lit LED MP3 player, and the quality and clarity is nothing short of amazing.

You're arguing that having less battery life is a worse thing... in no imaginable situation is that true. Just, dude... it's not.

I'm not saying it's a worse thing, I'm saying have 16 hours of video against 8 hours of video is good, but that it's like saying a car can go up to 500mph, because it's not needed. How will the gaming and the apps be on the Zune, because that's what I'd imagine most Touch users spend time on.

They don't cater to your needs. They release products that will make them money. Fortunately for us, competition makes better, cheaper products. Better, cheaper products that we can buy.

Do you even know the price, or what Apple's price will be? Last time the Zunes were more expensive.

This next point is difficult to interpret. You're saying that people won't know about it's superior screen due to bad advertising. Look, i understand hypothesizing but you've seen the absolute raw specifications of the device, nothing else. Your either a really big Apple fanboy or a severe pessimist, or doomsayer. Which one will it be?

No, I'm saying they need to really press hard on the advertising and do it very well, they'll stand no chance.

Because you don't actually turn your screen off. You just dim the backlight, there's still power going to it.

Really? But if I toggle the screen brightness all the way down on my Mac or PC, I can sometimes see the text beneath. On my iPod, though, I can't see anything.

And your point about not going a day without access to a charger, maybe not. But say, i'm a Zune owner... i have no need. Who would go out of their way to charge there device just to prove a point, dude you're just grasping at straws.

I'm grasping at straws? The product hasn't even been released, and you're saying it's better because of a longer battery life and a radio. What about price, usability, accessories etc.? Apple currently hold the leading market share, so like in PC/Mac Debate, they'll be more products for them, better support etc.

[Emo_Nemo]

Magical, you're just being obnoxious here. From what we've seen so far, (which, if i'm honest, isn't that much) this Zune will be better in almost every way than the iPod Touch. And you're saying that despite all of these features, it will fail because of a bad advertising campaign and it will still be worse than the iPod Touch... forgive me if i can't see your reasoning here, but dude...

If you read my post; I did not say it would fail. I said if they do what they did last time it will fail.

It does make a difference on a smaller screen, trust me. I've got one, a 2.2" screen. I just changed from a 2.2" back lit LED MP3 player, and the quality and clarity is nothing short of amazing.

You're arguing that having less battery life is a worse thing... in no imaginable situation is that true. Just, dude... it's not.

I'm not saying it's a worse thing, I'm saying have 16 hours of video against 8 hours of video is good, but that it's like saying a car can go up to 500mph, because it's not needed. How will the gaming and the apps be on the Zune, because that's what I'd imagine most Touch users spend time on.

They don't cater to your needs. They release products that will make them money. Fortunately for us, competition makes better, cheaper products. Better, cheaper products that we can buy.

Do you even know the price, or what Apple's price will be? Last time the Zunes were more expensive.

This next point is difficult to interpret. You're saying that people won't know about it's superior screen due to bad advertising. Look, i understand hypothesizing but you've seen the absolute raw specifications of the device, nothing else. Your either a really big Apple fanboy or a severe pessimist, or doomsayer. Which one will it be?

No, I'm saying they need to really press hard on the advertising and do it very well, they'll stand no chance.

Because you don't actually turn your screen off. You just dim the backlight, there's still power going to it.

Really? But if I toggle the screen brightness all the way down on my Mac or PC, I can sometimes see the text beneath. On my iPod, though, I can't see anything.

And your point about not going a day without access to a charger, maybe not. But say, i'm a Zune owner... i have no need. Who would go out of their way to charge there device just to prove a point, dude you're just grasping at straws.

I'm grasping at straws? The product hasn't even been released, and you're saying it's better because of a longer battery life and a radio. What about price, usability, accessories etc.? Apple currently hold the leading market share, so like in PC/Mac Debate, they'll be more products for them, better support etc.

As far as advertising they are spending 100m alone on just a tv advertising campaign for their new search engine this one will get some major advertising dollars.
As far as pricing goes my Zune 8gb was cheaper then the comparable nano and at the same time does more. They will be the same price Microsoft has the revenue to even go cheaper id they wanted to.
Usability here is a video just the prototype has a more fluid interface then the iPod touch with absolutely no signs of lag. Even the accelerometer is faster notice on iPhone and other phones it takes a few seconds to change orientation. The Zune does it instantly.

Either way i'll buy it whether it becomes big or not I don't base my decisions on if everyone else has one.

This post has been edited by Emo_Nemo: May 29 2009, 05:04 PM

[Caboose]

Magical, you're just being obnoxious here. From what we've seen so far, (which, if i'm honest, isn't that much) this Zune will be better in almost every way than the iPod Touch. And you're saying that despite all of these features, it will fail because of a bad advertising campaign and it will still be worse than the iPod Touch... forgive me if i can't see your reasoning here, but dude...

If you read my post; I did not say it would fail. I said if they do what they did last time it will fail.

It does make a difference on a smaller screen, trust me. I've got one, a 2.2" screen. I just changed from a 2.2" back lit LED MP3 player, and the quality and clarity is nothing short of amazing.

You're arguing that having less battery life is a worse thing... in no imaginable situation is that true. Just, dude... it's not.

I'm not saying it's a worse thing, I'm saying have 16 hours of video against 8 hours of video is good, but that it's like saying a car can go up to 500mph, because it's not needed. How will the gaming and the apps be on the Zune, because that's what I'd imagine most Touch users spend time on.

They don't cater to your needs. They release products that will make them money. Fortunately for us, competition makes better, cheaper products. Better, cheaper products that we can buy.

Do you even know the price, or what Apple's price will be? Last time the Zunes were more expensive.

This next point is difficult to interpret. You're saying that people won't know about it's superior screen due to bad advertising. Look, i understand hypothesizing but you've seen the absolute raw specifications of the device, nothing else. Your either a really big Apple fanboy or a severe pessimist, or doomsayer. Which one will it be?

No, I'm saying they need to really press hard on the advertising and do it very well, they'll stand no chance.

Because you don't actually turn your screen off. You just dim the backlight, there's still power going to it.

Really? But if I toggle the screen brightness all the way down on my Mac or PC, I can sometimes see the text beneath. On my iPod, though, I can't see anything.

And your point about not going a day without access to a charger, maybe not. But say, i'm a Zune owner... i have no need. Who would go out of their way to charge there device just to prove a point, dude you're just grasping at straws.

I'm grasping at straws? The product hasn't even been released, and you're saying it's better because of a longer battery life and a radio. What about price, usability, accessories etc.? Apple currently hold the leading market share, so like in PC/Mac Debate, they'll be more products for them, better support etc.

Still, there were some good quality adverts for the Zune, as i showed you. What went wrong exactly?

You haven't replied to this comment.

It's not like that at all though, with a car such as that you wont hope to reach it's potential, at least not on legal roads. But with a longer battery life, you will take advantage of it. You don't charge it after 6 hours of use, which is what you would do if it were the same as the car. You wait until it's depleted, then recharge it. I can't envisage charging this device more than once a week. As for gaming and the apps, i assume it will be plentiful. The hardware seems to be more capable than the iPods and you can easily develop games for the current Zune, so i don't see why it should be different.

No, i don't know the pricing. But as far as i know, in the states the Zunes were cheaper. Also, how would Microsoft hope to compete in such a market with overpriced goods? I predict it will be like ATI v nVidia, always dropping prices to compete with the other. All the better for us consumers

I don't see why, i mean there will always be ignorant people who buy things just for their popularity, but if it does turn out okay then i see no reason for people not to get it over an iPod touch, especially if it does turn out cheaper. A few people on these forums certainly might, despite advertising, although as Emo pointed out there's enough money going into advertising to make it good.

I may be wrong, but i've read a lot of good sources that say you're just turning the screen black, not off. This allows it to be turned back on a lot faster, but with a larger power drain.

I never said it would be better. I'm reserving judgement until at least after E3, but from what i have seen so far i'm hopefull that it will be a good product. And since Microsoft hold a larger market share in the PC market, it's likely that there will be more PC/Zune compatability than that of the iPhone.