I think that Sals should put up a set of rules for mods for banning people in the clan chat. Pretty much whenever
I go on rs I go on Sals cc, and I was pretty undignified when I got kicked for telling your mom jokes. They weren't offensive (eg. someone says: "that's shallow", and I say "Your moms shallow, as in she can't swim". I didn't get a warning first, I just got booted. I think the clear set of rules should be:

No abusing the power
Give a warning before banning
Don't ban people unless theyre spamming, flaming or asking for personal info or anything against the rs code of conduct
Don't ban people if they're just being annoying (telling your mom jokes, even bad ones) and if you really, really hate them, at least tell them to stop.

Comment, and please don't take this as an insult all you mods. I just think that this should be out there. I'll edit if you think of anything i should add/ subtract.

For future reference:

1. Your mom jokes aren't funny.
2. They are spam.
3. A number of them can be considered offensive.

You're currently suspended, I'll let the mod that suspended you explain further if they so choose.

I do belive some Rules need to be re-written, but most of them are clear.


By saying Your Mom jokes, you are flaming.
If you would have never been banned, you would have never made this topic.


- W1z

Cxkslei:

1. I said quote "even if they aren't funny"
2. They're not spam, I'm not going
Your mom
Your mom
Your mom
Your mom
3. If none of them are offensive, how can a number been offensive?
4. I'm just a little outraged about all this. Should I really get kicked for an hour for saying bad your mom jokes?

_________________________________________________________________________
W1z:
I'm sorry, i might not understand the definition of flaming. This isn't sarcasm, i actually don't think i do. Someone please clarify. And yes, if I hadn't been, banned, I wouldn't have made this topic. I thought that was pretty obvious.

You weren't kicked for saying your mom jokes. Since this is a similar situation, I'll treat it the same as the last. You're currently suspended for flaming and flame baiting. this suspension ends on April 11, 2009 11:37AM EST.

To explain flaming, flaming is the act of insulting, defaming, or being slanderous towards another user on any online community. Flame baiting is the act of attempting to get someone to insult, defame, or be slanderous towards yourself in an online community. That's as basic as I can put it.

Aww cmon, a week? I do need a clear definition of flaming, I may agree with you.

Sal's Forum Chat Channel Guidelines | Sal's Clan Chat - Who To Contact

I think there is a misunderstanding of what "abusing their powers" really means. The chat moderators are there to promote discussion and punish those who infringe in the rules. If you break a rule as posted in the CC Guidelines, you should expect to be kicked from the chat. Don't look for a warning first, look for a big boot. A verbal warning is just the individual being nice, but it surely isn't required. You should consider yourself lucky to have gotten a warning, but don't push your luck.

As stated in the CC Guidelines, you are not allowed to disrespect other chat participants, which you clearly did with those jokes. As such, these jokes are considered spam in Sal's CC in which users have been warned and booted for telling them. There is a rule in the CC Guidelines that verifies no spamming is allowed, so there is a second reason to have kicked you or a similar user out.

Then there is the ability for a CC mod to temporarily add a rule to the chat as they please. This is in direct relation to the Additional section at the bottom of the guidelines, which your jokes fall directly under. Here it is again for your benefit and for the benefit of others too.


I hope you read through both of these threads I posted and become a more respectful user of Sal's CC in the future. As always, if you have a problem with a chat moderator, you should most definitely discuss the matter privately with this user or a superior of such user. In Sal's Chat Channel: CC Mod < Distinguished Member < Forum Moderator < Forum Admin < Salmoneus.

I do apologize if I offended anyone, I said like three (not 300) your mom jokes, all meant to be nothing more then slightly annoying. I am also not inferring by putting in a rule "Do not abuse the power" that in this situation someone was abusing they're power, I think that should just be a general rule. I also probably would have contacted a specific player, if I knew who it was. It was either Goggie or Lord earth, so whoever it was, would you mind posting on this topic and explaining yourself? I understand some of what I did was wrong and against the rules, but I also dont think you should be as harsh as a 7-day ban. These rules are important, but instead of just booting me for a week, couldn't you have just taken a more sensible approach and either said on the cc or pmed me to stop? If you had done that and I had continued, I would say it is completely fair, maybe even generous, to give me a week ban, but otherwise, I think a verbal warning would be more apropriate. By the way, thank you very much everyone who's posted/ or taken the time to read this, I am just trying to explain myself.

Like I said, you should never go looking for a warning. A warning is just that individual moderator being nice, but it isn't required. Learn from your mistakes and use better judgment in the future.

For the part about 300, it meant that if a chat moderator noticed a problem so many times in the past, they'll quickly put a stop to it now. As "momma jokes" have been a problem in the past, the chat moderators halted the discussion before it got out of hand. It doesn't mean you can tell 300 "momma jokes" before you can be expected to be warned or kicked.

I kicked you because you were flaming,and you were using 'your mum' jokes in a malicious way towards someone in the Chat, and it was tantamount to Flame-baiting. Now i've seen you in the chat quite a few times, and i'm sure you know the Rules by now. Flaming is not accepted in the Chat, and I know everyone has their own opinions on what is offensive or not, but in my eyes it was flaming and for that reason I kicked you. I took action as I felt that you were behaving badly, and decided that it was not a good idea for those kind of jokes to be acceptable in the Chat, or that flaming will be tolerated under any circumstances. Now, the reason I gave 7 days is that I felt that you (as a member of the chat) were not behaving by the preset Clan Chat Guidelines, and 'your mum' jokes are actually very offensive to some people.

I will review my actions (I always try to be as fair as possible), but I bid you to review yours too.

~Gogs


edit: I fail @ grammer

Well there could lie the problem. A moderator doesn't have to be nice, but why I like sals so much is that it is a nice community. I choose to go to sals because it stands out so much from all other RS sites. Instead of gaining personal profit, you can have discussions without being mean to one another. Now, to have that nice discussion, you can't exactly have people telling your mamma jokes. To get rid of this problem, you can A. Tell them to stop, or B. Boot them for a week. What the mods are attempting to do is make it more enjoyable for everyone, so say there are 10 people in the chat, including me. If you choose A., 10 are happy, 0 are unhappy. Option B. makes 9 happy, leaves 1 outraged. There is more then one way to keep sals a nice community, and it seems obvious that you choose the option that makes everyone happy.

P.S. Goggie, I have reviewed my actions and I realize I have done something wrong. I also think the way you dealt with this is wrong.

I usually tend not to go gung-ho when it comes to Kicking someone from the Chat, unless they're doing something particularly bad. Now arguably in this case you didn't fit that bracket, and in most cases I would give a Warning and then if they persisted, I would have Kicked them. But in this case, I kicked you after making your third 'joke', and after flaming another user because I felt that you knew of the gravity of your actions, and so that was why I kicked you. My reasoning for the 7-day ban is that I decided that it was suited to the offences in question (Flaming and flame-baiting via 'your mum' jokes directed at another user) and that from this Temporary Ban, you would learn from your actions not to behave in this manner again.

Bear in mind, what I say is not final, other Chat Moderators, DM's etc. can post what they feel on any rulings made concerning the Kos, and if it is decided that my actions were in some part unfair, then the decision will be changed.

The thing I ask myself after reading this topic, was it really worth 7 days?

That's for the CC Mods, DMs, Mods, Politoburo and Enemy of the People to Decide.

well i might as well come in the disscussion myself
i kno u guys are doing ur duty
but the bans given are a bit too much
goggie and dj kno wat im talking about
no1 actually cares of this unless it comes to them
and i strongly support the part on getting a warning to stop instead of getting a 5-7 day ban

Actually 5 and 7 days are given out, not that often. Most of the time it's 3 .

P-mods mods don't need to give warnings in game before muting people. Neither should moderators given authority in a clan chat. People know the rules. You kill someone, you don't get a warning to not do it next time. Extreme example, but same principle.

u slap a guy ur sent to jail for the rest of ur life?

It goes for the general population to tell their opinions when it's put in a topic for all to see like this.

Tbh I do think MOD's should atleast say something first and if it continues kick them its not that much of a bother. Who honestly would of thought a your mom joke would be flaming? No one really takes them seriously and if they do that person should step up and say something.




Why not? Because they can't handle someone saying something to defend there case?
How was he supposed to know it was considered flaming? Has this game honestly became that uptight that someone can't say a harmless joke without it being misinterpreted?

Well if that guy was of very important status, that would be understand-able.

ANYWAYS, I've been in the chat while people have told "yo mama" jokes, they're very annoying, I agree with that, but I don't really think its worth a 7 day ban Other people could disagree but, 7 days sounds a bit harsh.

Well said! I suggested a verbal warn before adding a warn for questionably offensive sentences; the topic got closed

Once again, you didn't listen.

The suspension is also for flaming/flame baiting. Like it says in the guidelines, if you have a problem with the punishment either pm the moderator in charge or a user who is our superior, then we review the case and make any modification needed.

Once again, that's not the case, if it's in a topic for the general population to discuss. And did the person he said it to find it offensive?

In the context it was in, it doesn't matter if the person found it offensive or not. If we deem it to be a flame or a flame bait, we are allowed to act on it. Why should we wait and let it erupt into a heated argument instead of pre-emptively stopping it? As for your topic, you have to remember you need seven warns to get banned providing you don't do something extreme (post pornography), and after a month you can ask for a warn review which would be at the moderators discretion to lower your warn level. Your topic made no logical sense, nor would it be useful to enforce against violators.

Flame baiting once again how was he supposed to know? I'm going to assume the person he said them to never said anything? And the MOD never said that he would like him to stop? How was he supposed to know if it caused problems in the past? A invisible 3 strikes doesn't work if the person doesn't know he's doing anything wrong thats like telling my brother i'm going to give him candy at the end of a car trip but not mention that he can't talk more then 3 times. Surely this should be reassessed and warnings given in the future?

Because there isn't a strike system in the chat. We treat each situation on a different basis. Of course if you never told the kid that he couldn't talk that would be unreasonable. However it's stated in the guidelines that you are NOT to do what he did.



Flaming goes as discrimination, and since it was directed at a particular user it falls under disrespect.

If the person doesn't find it offensive, the mod has no right to kick. That's like the victim deciding not to press charges, and the person getting jailed anyway.

We have every right to. You aren't to decide what we are able to do or not. We're tasked with making sure the chat is a friendly place, and we are to prevent or terminate problems before or as they exist. That's our job.

You have to remember, for every action you do, although it isn't always obvious, there is a consequence.

Yourself:Your mom goes to college.
Person:Lol, you got that off of Napoleon Dynamite didn't you?!?
CCMod:Kick
You have been kicked from the channel.

Doesn't make sense does it?

And? My mom does go to college big deal, she graduates this semester, I'm happy for her.

The problem is it was specifically directed at a user, it wasn't general. That's the difference.

But if the person it was directed at thinks it's funny, why should the person who said it get a 7 day ban?

Now you're just making up random scenarios which you know won't happen.
If you are referring to Avram, not only did say a "Yo Momma" joke but he also broke another rule. Because he has been in the CC for a while, he should know the rules by now. Ignorance of the rules is not our fault.

i got 5 day kos
this is wat happend
5 mins b4 update:

dj gavri:im gonna stay till 30sec's before update,a lot of ppl spam that time
i mis-interpret it and think he's gonna be spamming along for fun
donwonton:@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
donwonton:@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
you have been kicked from the channel

next day i go on the cc
i get kicked and informed that i have a 5 day kos on me

The rules need tightening. The maturity of the chat has been dropping a lot this past month/four weeks, and it's getting to the point where I invite my friends to my chat.

Personally, I think it's a reasonable ban. Just because you're being an idiot, doesn't mean you can stay in there. Have you considered the general population of the chat and the fact that you're annoying every single one of them?

More people have posted on this then I have expected, so I can't comment on all of them. Someone said something about not getting a warning about killing someone, but someone said "If you slap someone, do you go to jail the rest of your life?" Thank you! This is exactly what I'm getting at. And People have been saying that Mods don't need to give out warnings. I agree with whoever said, "why not"? Can they not deal with the answer? It's wierd, because I atleast sort of know some of the mods and they don't seem to mean. Goggie, you said you booted me because "I thought you understood the gravity of the situation". I don't mean to offend anyone here, but are you kidding? They're your mamma jokes! At most, slightly annoying. I think even an hour ban would be to much. Certainly it's not too much to ask to give a warning?

You crossed the line when you directed it at another user, it's not the "yo mama" jokes you were kicked for, it was for maliciously inciting them against someone.

Anyway, why should you be given a warning if you've been doing it repeatedly (in this case 3 yo mama jokes) and you've been around the chat long enough to know the rules?

The whole point! It didn't sound malicious!

yea like 4 of em

Opinion is in the eyes of the holder.

It should have been the opinion of the one it was directed at.

So you think four people are going to have to put up with one's immaturity because he believes he shouldn't be kicked?

Not put up with it, should've been warned first.

alrite i shuld have been warned
and wat is the unreasonable 5 day kos for?

You got added to the kos for spamming, if I'm correct, from what you said in your post. It wasn't unreasonable.

It says on the Kos for spamming whilst Runescape updates were happening.
If you want more information, it would be best to ask the Chat Mod who kicked you.

Those are rules for mods, but what about rules for people liek you?

You're still not getting it are you? As of the moment you enter the clan chat you are in a contract with Sals, we are in charge of keeping it friendly. It isn't your opinion, the opinion of the person it was directed at or anyone else. If we let it go on the chat would deteriorate into nothing but a flame fest. As of entering the clan chat you agreed that you have read and will comply with the rules. We are charged with enforcing them, and preemptively stopping something before it occurs is better then letting it manifest, you can agree with that I'm sure. In addition if we did nothing there would be a constant flood of complaints about how "poor" the clan chat is because of things like what you're suggesting would allow problems to run rampant.


You spammed, you've been here quite a while. I don't see it as unreasonable, nor was it funny.

@little boy: What?

as i said before i misinterpreted the chat mods words
and for something like that dont u think it shuld be a smaller ban say 1day?