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Blade_V1per

Ts Vs Relentless Scr Tourny

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Re-warring completely changes the outcome....

 

1. Gives Ts another chance..

2. Different Numbers of People on Each Side...

3. Completely Throws off the whole concept of a rematch, because it's not the same senario (Hence the curse and weakening spells)

 

Just because having curse/weakening spells, doesn't really mean the whole match was heavily affected... but by doing a rematch that just completely changes everything..

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WHAT!! We have already admitted to using Curse We never denied using it

 

Who said we been denying it.....

 

+1 on what ab said

 

Why is this still an issue ffs lets get on with it so we can start training for our next round...

 

Cheers

Ty

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Still don't get it. So your telling us, that curses has ko'ed their members? when some didn't even pray? I think even if we didn't have curses it won't change the outcome of this fight. When they clearly stated that their members were paying attention to TeamSpeak and Cc and thats how they got ko'ed, that isn't our problem.

 

Nonetheless, Ts didn't say we couldn't use them, they didn't tell us either that we were defending in this fight, isn't that the same concept? It didn't really change the outcome of this fight did it? For us curses/weaking spells is classified as hybridding. They should've clarified that in the beginning when we were discussing rules. We also stopped using them when we were told to, you can see that in the video, which is still uploading (at 60% atm). Btw, just to clarify to Ts, even if you do get to go to the next round, we'll declare on you for your Raw rank - you have no problem of that am i correct? because you want to rematch us so badly.

Edited by Phantom_xi

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Well according to our member(Priestess875), if what you claim is true then why did your people continue to spam/eat when you called a retreat, and you can't just null a war, wtf is that lol.

 

 

My specific point was, if you look at the people who were killed quickly because they did not eat and you look at the people who called spams and attacked relentless, you see overlap.

 

Simply put:

 

The same people who stopped eating, called spams and attacked Relentless members clear to the end.

 

Now I must say, I am not opposed to a rematch. However, I would like to point out that I had EXTREME difficulty in making the FIRST war because of the timing, and I am sure that I was not alone in this. Although I know I will make sacrafices to attend a rematch, if it is necessary, other members may not be able to - that gives TS the advantage in a rematch, since TS is calling for a rematch and is setting the rules.

 

In addition, I wonder what would happen if Relentless were to win in a second war against TS. Would we be called cheaters again? Would there, again, be little proof of any wrongdoing? Will TS call a rematch every time they lose? I wonder.

 

I would also like to say, that I am very dissapointed in the general attitude displayed by this thread and the chats in our IRC. Up until this point, I have been a passive viewer - and although being in Relentless does give me some bias, I know where blame lies.

 

I am dissapointed in the attitudes displayed by Relentless members - but I am even MORE dissapointed in the attitudes displayed by both TS Members and Leadership.

 

What sort of an example does this provide for members?

 

I think the best solution for now, would be to take a 2-3 break from the issue. Give both sides time to cool down and view the event with objectivity and logic instead of the anger, accusations, and defensiveness displayed by members of both clans.

 

Just my two pieces.

 

I Don't See why your disappointed with TS ive Tried Several times to Civily Discuss with R + Ts leaders they just overview most of it and continue with whats going on lol, ah well ti was a good fight I don't mind if We Re-match or lose its a game, you play to lose, but besides that the Time was messed up for both of us ^_^ We had to Sacrifice all your GMT people since it was around 11:00-12:00 pm GMT.

 

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I do not believe that you are the only person with leadership responsibilities in TS. From what I have seen, you have indeed acted with civility and respect - I appreciate that. It does not, however, nullify the actions of other TS leaders or members.

 

My point with the time change, is that the time is being CHANGED. If this is to be a "re-match" doesn't it make sense to give Relentless and TS the same footing that they were given the first time around?

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Uhh Bolty will make his decision :o

 

thats for remembering me.........

 

and me and bolt will have to discuss. i will talk to him about it next time i see him on

 

edit: like bolty said need video to prove the use of the curse spell. well unless relentless does admit to it

 

Flame, you're out of the loop. ;) That's not quite what I wanted to look at.

 

 

Remember... dead topic. ;)

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Here is my 2 cents, not that it matters lol but just my point of view. I think if it was not said that "curses" were nto allowed then whats the problem here? The rules clearly state that everything is allowed, the sals that is. Your rules says no binds/blasts so why then would u think curses are not allowed? if it wasnt stated and sals rules says everything goes then thats that. As for you telling your crew not to eat, or to stop fighting. I think that was a mistake on your part, unless you have clear cut proof of them breaking rules that you set, such as "blasts" or "binds being casted and u have it on cam thats another story. But even at that why chance it? Whats to say that you still cant win even if they do use binds/blasts and cheat... if you win through that then this wouldnt be a problem.

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Ok, again i have to say wow. We can not agree on a solution on this topic and i am upset. I tried to work with TS.

 

Even after watching the video still see no blasts which was agreed upon by both clans. Lets go from there.!?

 

Now, i must say it has come to the worst possible why. Make it the choice for Sals. (I hate the way it sounds)(lol, nothing to slas just should not have to come down to them)

 

Again, if what was provided by us did not meet your need for an open channel to talk to us. First off i had members leave and all others in chat right away(but relentless councils and you). You know that Blade_V1per i did every thing to open this up to you and have a fair chat. I am also upset as you. Also wanted you and all your members to be there as well.

 

Next time a neutral chat i guess would work better. I would like to thank you for the time you did try to reach an agreement with us.

 

Again, as the clan world goes we must move on..... As for the sals topic dealing with the tourney every thing goes to make clans use every thing. It was ment as a learning process and to gain an idea where each clan truely stands. How to best use the new areas for combat. (This Case Clan Wars Arena)

 

By the basis of all tatics..... If i read correct. So on we go, we do not agree to that we worked with you like we suppose to today. Opps corrected yesterday! So we move on past that we did not follow sals tourney rules.

 

 

We set up our own.!? (Which was not wanted anyway)

 

 

So now the rules that apply are: (Took from full out list only thing left to go from)

 

 

A clan cheating first is irrelevant. If a clan cheats, take pictures and keep fighting. If you believe you have enough evidence to afford a null/DQ, you may walk out without penalty (pending sufficient evidence.) Do NOT cheat in retaliation, or your clan may be punished too. If you don't have sufficient evidence and walk out, the war may be nulled or called as a loss for you.

 

 

Now, there have been many topics with issues about unwritten rules, so,

This will list what we call "standard" rules. If a rule is not mentioned for an official fight, these rules will apply. If a specific rule different from these is made and agreed upon in a war, then that rule trumps this rule. These unwritten rules will be underlined.

 

small infraction in a blowout war will not affect the result.

A small infraction in a close war may or may not call for a null.

Infractions by the losing team don't matter towards rank as they lost.

 

Minor Infractions will not affect the outcome of a war unless the war was close, in which case the war will be nulled. (close = 20% of starting opts or fewer remaining for the winning clan)

 

Using combat styles that aren't allowed. – 3+ incidents in one war, or one extended one

 

 

 

 

Read top of this topic plz.

 

This is ment for all clans i did pull this from a posted topic of Reflections <3 (Thanks for rules that only prove right.)

 

 

First off Ts you did stop fighting, what does first sentence say????? Keep fighting and take pictures!!!!

 

 

If you believe you have enough evidence to afford a null/DQ, you may walk out without penalty (pending sufficient evidence.)

 

TS, has gone from we had extra people not on ml.(no evidence) To the out come comes from having curse/other non-combative spells.!?

 

 

Rule:

Now, there have been many topics with issues about unwritten rules, so, This will list what we call "standard" rules. If a rule is not mentioned for an official fight, these rules will apply. If a specific rule different from these is made and agreed upon in a war, then that rule trumps this rule. These unwritten rules will be underlined.

 

Now, as long as i have been playing RS if you have a clan war. With No Blasts This only includes magic types that cause damage. But if rule changed i would love to know about it.

 

So as stated by above rule this is trumped!!!!

 

No, we have never said we did not use, curse/weakness/confusion. It is upsetting you can change an topic from members not on ml too, non-combative magic used. (tbh i am upset i was told you where one of the best clans on sals) We never agreed on only binds. You again will never produce a picture on this either.

 

 

Again, I would like to thank you TS this was a good war and should have been closer. Next time never give up and get your proof. You are for sure the first clan to get a fight after the tourney is over...... As for this you have a chance to fight us again with rules agreed to. You want no curse/weakness/confusion then make sure you only say Binds only

 

 

 

 

 

Finishing, notes I would like to thank you again TS it was a good fight. You will be the first to get a fight from us either way. If this fight is given to R or Ts. Be expected to fight no backing down and clarify rules. Because next time they will be set so right there is no question who wins.

 

 

Good luck in the future TS you are a great clan and have alot going for you. Your future is bright.

 

 

Thanks,

 

Druwstan

Edited by druwstan

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Its up, took like 40 mins to process, bad quality :unsure:

 

Link: http://www.veoh.com/videos/v20985312R4WhmP7

 

 

Good fight Ts.

 

Something came up IRL, so I've got only like 5 minutes to post.

 

I can't deal with this until I get back home, hopefully within 8-10 hours... :aware: My apologies.

 

 

I think its best that we decide...

 

But sals have the last say i guess...

 

Hope they take the time to read our defences

 

and lets hope they decide whats right =D

 

If R/TS can come to an agreement, that would be best, but if you can't, then flame and I will have to make one. :P

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Its up, took like 40 mins to process, bad quality :unsure:

 

Link: http://www.veoh.com/videos/v20985312R4WhmP7

 

 

Good fight Ts.

 

Something came up IRL, so I've got only like 5 minutes to post.

 

I can't deal with this until I get back home, hopefully within 8-10 hours... :aware: My apologies.

 

 

I think its best that we decide...

 

But sals have the last say i guess...

 

Hope they take the time to read our defences

 

and lets hope they decide whats right =D

 

If R/TS can come to an agreement, that would be best, but if you can't, then flame and I will have to make one. :P

 

Kk well this will be my last post on this topic ok bolty

 

just wanted to say a little bit after 6 min into the video you see them use curse on Boy(idk the numbers) so yes R did use a curse.

 

so if the R officials and the TS Officials can work something out that be best

 

P.S. some pretty good songs in that video from R. im alive by flyleaf and bleed it out by linkin park... good songs =]

Edited by flameman29

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I don't think we'll ever come to an agreement lol :jester:

 

As i said again, judging from the video, does curse/weakening spells have an outcome on the fight? Because I myself, only saw it like 4-5 times. As druw stated, that the rules clearly say No blasts and it didn't mention anything about curses/weakning spells, i didn't see anything that we did wrong. It couldn't have affected the war in any case, half of your members were 1 hitted or ko'ed before it was thrown lol.

 

If you want a Rematch for this Tournament it won't happen, we proved to you we've dominated in this (31 people starting, 25 ending), you guys fought till the end, not our problem if your members weren't paying attention and were getting ko'ed, our weakening/curses was stopped being used when you guys told us to. If you say were scared to fight you then think again; we'll be giving you a 2nd chance for this Tournament,which you clearly don't deserve because you've lost in our eyes.

 

Nonetheless, your false accusations with Josie Perez attending the war - pictures and not words please?

 

Quit whining and take a loss already, i'm tired of this lol. Even if you say our curses/weakening spells made us win this thats totally bull, because you know you've been dominated in the video. Its your problem not telling your members to fight or eat, not ours. You don't have any sufficient proof that we "cheated". The rules clearly doesn't say anything about using curse/weakening spells not being used. You told us we were allowed to hybrid, and thats what hybridding is for us, so its not our fault that you weren't clear about your own rules. Did i say how you jumped from 53 members to 60 during the fight prep? Lol.

 

 

Edit:

 

Vid Link: http://www.veoh.com/videos/v20985312R4WhmP7

 

i think i've gained 30 posts count from this topic alone lol

Edited by Phantom_xi

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I read up to the fifth page, then it started getting repetitive.

 

This is how I see it.

 

The initial accusation (first post) was because Relentless used a weaken spell. They didnt deny this...neither should they. I look at it in two ways, if they want to waste their runes/inventory with that spell, then you should be happy that they arent concentrating more on binding, and "hybriding" does not restrict someone to only binding. If you said only binding in your rules, then you shouldve been more clear with it, because it seems like they understood it as in "hybriding" or "no blasting".

 

Okay....and then you guys started accusing Relentless of bringing members who were not theirs. They provided sufficient information to disprove you (imo), provided the rules that were agreed upon, their memberlists (active and retired), and their opts pic. You cannot provide pictures of your accusations, so there isnt much of a debate.

 

And for the future. If you are warring someone, whether you believe they cheated or not, but are not completely sure or do not have evidence of it yet, then do not ask your members to purposely lose -- there is always a chance that you are wrong about your accusations. Although words are wonderful, they dont tend to be the best thing to rely on.

 

Congratulations Relentless on your win, I dont think Ive posted on your topic yet.

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I HAVE EDITED THE ORIGINAL TOPIC TO THIS, THE REAL POINT OF THIS TOPIC.

 

Me and Relentless leaders got into a chat to discuss this. The chat started out productive, but as we got further and further into it, more and more people started joining, until it was 8 relentless against me in the chat. When they started ganging up on me i felt it was time for me to leave and post here.

 

From this point on, I am dropping any accusations about additional members for Relentless because I just don't have the proof to convict them of that. I will only be focusing on the maging factor.

 

War rules:

* Full out

* Clan Arena

* Rune

* Melee And Range

* Hybryding allowed

* Ts Wears Green capes

* Ts Can defend

* No Bounds

* Memberlist is locked Tommorow

 

It is very easy to say by these rules that there was to be no maging allowed, and Relentless has confirmed that they have the same rules as I do.

 

But during the fight, they were using curses to lower our defense. Johnny claims that he thought this was a part of Hybriding. If this is the case then a simple rematch with clearer understanding of the rules would be a simple solution to this mix up. But Relentless feel like they have won this war fair and square, even though they used curses.

 

But the thing is, not only did they use curses, but when i saw this happening, I spammed our clan chat the best I could to stop fighting, that Relentless cheated(cheating sounds harsh as it was just a mistake). But since I told my members not to fight, that'd we'd null it and have a rematch, a lot of my members did not eat, but just let Relentless kill them.

 

I don't think its fair for them to claim the win, when so many of my members decided not to fight because there was cheating involved.

 

I am asking Relentless kindly to give us a rematch, any day you'd like, to solve this problem once and for all, so we can really say who won this war fairly.

 

--Blade_V1per / Paariah

Leader of True Supremacy

 

From this point on, I am dropping any accusations about additional members for Relentless because I just don't have the proof to convict them of that. I will only be focusing on the maging factor.

 

Consider it dropped...

 

But during the fight, they were using curses to lower our defense. Johnny claims that he thought this was a part of Hybriding. If this is the case then a simple rematch with clearer understanding of the rules would be a simple solution to this mix up. But Relentless feel like they have won this war fair and square, even though they used curses.

 

Consider a curse only lowers your defense 5%. Now, if I were to take this assumption to a larger potential, you might have killed an extra 10% of R members. So, that would mean about 3 more kills than you had. I do seriously doubt this had a serious effect on the war. :(

 

But the thing is, not only did they use curses, but when i saw this happening, I spammed our clan chat the best I could to stop fighting, that Relentless cheated(cheating sounds harsh as it was just a mistake). But since I told my members not to fight, that'd we'd null it and have a rematch, a lot of my members did not eat, but just let Relentless kill them.

 

It certainly didn't look like that in the vid.

 

 

 

Even if I were to take all these assumptions for truth, it really doesn't look like it was enough to call for a null. I have no problem with allowing a rematch, but R is quite adamant, and the two clans could not come to a reconcilliation. Going on "proof" and nothing more, I can't really force a rematch.

 

The tourney would be disrupted, and that would lead to more issues and debates...I really don't have a choice but giving R the win...

 

So, for that, R will get the win...

 

I do ask that TS challenge R after the tourney. You can still gain their rank that way if that is a goal for you. If it's not, you can still prove who is better.

 

 

If you have concerns, pm me.

 

 

Sorry for leaving you out on this one flame, but you're out of the loop, and there isn't really time to freeze everything. Come back soon. :(

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Oh Thank you for finally solving it.

 

and Yes Ts, You will get your rematch sooner then you expect :(

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