Why Jagex Sucks

[NoSouls]

DISCLAIMER: This thread contains OPINIONS/IDEAS only, anything claimed to be factual may not be true and with that said, we enjoy our freedom of speech to collaboratively work out why Jagex isn't like the old Jagex. This thread is to be read as complaints and not to be taken as libel nor slander. If you have any issues with reading POTENTIAL reasons why Jagex may suck or is not doing very well, please leave now. Anyone that engages in discussing Jagex negatively SHALL not be held responsible (legally) for expressing their opinions as per the United States First Amendment. EVEN if someone below claims something to be factual, use your own judgment as to whether it is or not indeed factual.

 

In this thread we are going to talk STRICTLY about (some are related, but just for ideas):

1. Why Jagex sucks.

2. What mistakes they have made.

3. What features they have ruined.

4. What items are useless.

5. How messed up they made the economy.

6. How badly they made PvP-lovers or player-killers ditch the game.

7. The cosmetics that are useless and even annoying (GUI, interface).

Edited February 18, 2014 by NoSouls

[Sobend]

I'm not going to go as far as saying they suck as a company considering they had their highest profits ever last year, but I do not understand why they have not listened to the player killing group... the proposed added material into the wilderness would not take a ton of dev time (probably less than the new grandmaster quest that is coming out) and would do so much for the game.

 

They also need to revitalize dead content more. Not just the wilderness, but minigames also (Trouble Brewing, once a fun game to play with people, is now forgotten).

[Shooter585]

You should spell out your points better. Right now there is not much substance for discussion. It would be like me saying

 

In this thread, we will discussing why oranges are delicious.

 

-Apples just don't stack up, sorry

-they make you live longer

-Vitamin C

Edited February 17, 2014 by Shooter585

[Mohorak]

Now THIS thread, I can partially get behind. I'm just going to mention a few things.

1) Micro-transactions (changes the spirit of the game)

2) Completely dumping FunOrb support

3) War of Legends (they didn't even make the game, just published it to make money off of, which is why it's the archetypical micro-transaction-based game)

4) Now controlled by an American corporation

[Shooter585]

4) Now controlled by an American corporation

Yes, American corporations are eeeevil!!!

 

I don't understand this criticism, though I've heard it a lot. There are many American corporations, and some produce games that according to some are better than Runescape. You could argue that the corporation that owns them is just trying to squeeze all the money it can out of Jagex, but that's not because it's an American corporation. That's because it is a type of corporation that does it. There are British, Japanese, Canadian, and probably Namibian corporations that do that too.

[Mohorak]

4) Now controlled by an American corporation

Yes, American corporations are eeeevil!!!

 

I don't understand this criticism, though I've heard it a lot. There are many American corporations, and some produce games that according to some are better than Runescape. You could argue that the corporation that owns them is just trying to squeeze all the money it can out of Jagex, but that's not because it's an American corporation. That's because it is a type of corporation that does it. There are British, Japanese, Canadian, and probably Namibian corporations that do that too.

 

I'm pretty sure if a Nambian corporation took over Blizzard, its values would change and there would be a huge uproar.

[Sobend]

I similarly agree that saying that they are being controlled by an American corporation is not a satisfactory reason. It's also a bit stereotypical.

[NoSouls]

I similarly agree that saying that they are being controlled by an American corporation is not a satisfactory reason. It's also a bit stereotypical.

 

We're looking at the wrong thing. It is NOT the nationality of a corporation that screws up an entire game or gaming studio, it is the values of that business and the quality they push out. You can't have a small spider lay a nice bird egg. ;)

 

I know what we should do?! Let's research the companies that are controlling Jagex and see how mediocre or not they are?

 

I don't think he was trying to blame it on America though, although it did come across that way, let's all work together on this one (thread) though, let's unite and research into this. Let's dig up a good case as to what sucks about Jagex, because there are things that suck about every company. "Why Jagex Sucks" really means "What sucks about Jagex", I'm not saying Jagex is all suck, no good... but I think a lot of things are problematic with the company in its current state, so let's play Eye-Spy on this together. Let's team up, no fighting in this one. Sound good guys? :D

 

Tedder, Andrew Gower and Paul Gower left the board of directors as representatives from Raine and Spectrum joined.

 

http://runescape.wikia.com/wiki/Insight_Venture_Partners

 

I think this says something...

Edited February 18, 2014 by NoSouls

[NoSouls]

Insight Venture Partners is a venture capital firm

All I needed to hear. I've sat through several seminars about chemical start ups funded through venture capitalists. As soon as profits decline or the future looks grim they pull out, and the chemical company shuts down. Considering they're also invested in Twitter and Newegg, I don't expect them to be siphoning off money to pay for Jagex if it stops being a safe investment.

 

It seems the majority owners of Jagex are literally only in it for the money. (That's not to trash the staff of Jagex, who I think are definitely devoted to the game. Can't hate the people doing the work because of the board of directors.) I wonder if Jagex would fold completely if IVP puled out or if they'd just dramatically downsize. I wonder what laws surround that as well.

 

Lilshu, I love you now. You're a deep thinker and I really like that. I couldn't agree more with you too. Capitalism sucks and there are many reasons why. A quick Google will bring up some reasons.

 

Here are some links to read up on if anyone is interested:

http://www.slate.com...firms_suck.html

http://www.interwest...pitalists-suck/

 

More importantly, as I mentioned earlier how about we research the holders? A Google pulled this up:

http://www.gamefaqs....estory/62462762

 

This thread also discusses it a bit, I believe:

http://forum.tip.it/...the-rsof/page-4

 

Maybe we should also make an Insight Venture Partners Sucks thread too? They're running Jagex into the ground and I think the Gowers took off when additional investors got on board, because they probably hated the capitalist crap and were fed up when more jumped right on in. They likely figured that the capitalists would run their stuff right into the ground, so the Gowers dipped when RuneScape peaked. Although I suppose we could just publish it within this thread as technically they're 1 reason I believe Jagex sucks. Jagex is kind of at the end of the prodding pole and if the investors don't agree with what they are doing or going to do, the investor could threaten to pull out, I would assume.

 

I find it VERY ironic that the capitalist group invested into Jagex in 2005 and not too long after the wilderness just disappeared on us. Is anyone at all suspicious?

Edited February 18, 2014 by NoSouls

[O hai im KAMIL]

Is anyone at all suspicious?

 

Not really.

 

Anyway the two major things I dislike about Jagex right now is the fact that they're trying way too hard to please everyone. Legacy mode is an example of this, it shows that they don't have a clear direction in regards to combat and splitting combat into two major branches does nothing to progress the game.

 

The second thing is the amount of dead content in the game. Stuff like minigames, activities, defenders, etc. all have no use anymore and should either be reworked or removed.

[Mohorak]

As for the wilderness "disappearing" (it was really just wildy PKing, but I get what you're saying), I think the issue was them not understanding how to deal with bots and RWT—the whole "trade limit" debacle, and by extension the removal or severe alteration of PvP, was meant to prevent gold farmers trading massive amounts of gold to a customer. They probably thought it wasn't as big an issue to infuriate a minority (those who play RS mainly for PvP) as it turned out to be.

[Lonelywolf]

jagex are suck you are write no souls

 

i mean

where sTELLAR DAWN?

jagex the fans have spoken

[Mohorak]

i mean

where sTELLAR DAWN?

jagex the fans have spoken

 

There's another thing—they literally finished the game, were about to release it, and were like, "Nah, it's crap," and just completely trash it.

[reepicheep]

If we're going to talk about why Jagex sucks I think that we should also include the following: http://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/Jagex-Reviews-E322592.htm

 

It seems like upper management is the issue here, not that I think anybody would agree. It's quite unfortunate because I wouldn't be surprised if the vast majority of employees are really cool and love their work. It's unfortunate that the execs are so problematic.

[Mohorak]

I'm 99.7% sure that if Runescape fails, it's because of the higher-ups, mostly due to their complete ignorance as to how games work and why people play them.

 

BTW, the Bill of Rights is not recognized by the Internet, only in U.S. court. Any punishment doled out by website administration is purely to their discretion, so keep that in mind when posting.

Edited February 18, 2014 by Mohorak

[Sobend]

If we're going to talk about why Jagex sucks I think that we should also include the following: http://www.glassdoor...ews-E322592.htm

 

It seems like upper management is the issue here, not that I think anybody would agree. It's quite unfortunate because I wouldn't be surprised if the vast majority of employees are really cool and love their work. It's unfortunate that the execs are so problematic.

But... but... you get a free gym!

[NoSouls]

If we're going to talk about why Jagex sucks I think that we should also include the following: http://www.glassdoor...ews-E322592.htm

 

It seems like upper management is the issue here, not that I think anybody would agree. It's quite unfortunate because I wouldn't be surprised if the vast majority of employees are really cool and love their work. It's unfortunate that the execs are so problematic.

 

Thanks so much for that read, my sides hurt...

 

Cons – Ever since Andrew Gower left we've had the new CEO come in to fire up the content shredder.

 

'You know what we're gonna do team? We're going to take these quests here... and change them. Yeah. There's nothing wrong with them at all, but we have to update them after almost a DECADE because they're just too enjoyable.'

 

^This is just one of the though processes that occur on a weekly basis in the money-corrupted mind of Jagex.

 

On top of this is a plethora of terrible 'quality of life' changes such as the perfectly fine user interface being turned into a tacky Chrome cake tray. Striking a deal with Google at the expense of the game.

 

Most infuriatingly was the arrogant decision to change the looks of every Armour set in game. It's beyond me why they did this. Before, neat and sweet. After, clunky and ugly.

 

Don't even get me started on the DEVOLUTION of Combat. We touted this as the best update to ever happen to the game, yet for some reason we've lost a portion of our player base... I wonder why. I mean, who wouldn't want to play a combat mechanic which copies World of Warcraft and the bajillion other tab-target ability bar MMO's?

 

RuneScape is NOT the right format for these sort of changes.

Advice to Senior Management – Make Old School RuneScape a 'rebirth'. Right now it's pay to play, but soon you should make it open to free players, history repeating itself with how RuneScape started out.

Stop pandering to the newer players who just want the return of gambling. Focus on fixing bots and weaseling the content back in - the game is DYING yet it's your last hope.

 

I think I should point this out:

'We will never implement a lottery.'

Not only did you not keep to your word, but you have the audacity to deny that the Wheel of Fortune is a gambling mechanism wherein you can pay real life money to attain in-game rewards.

No, I would not recommend this company to a friend – I'm not optimistic about the outlook for this company

 

I'm 99.7% sure that if Runescape fails, it's because of the higher-ups, mostly due to their complete ignorance as to how games work and why people play them.

 

BTW, the Bill of Rights is not recognized by the Internet, only in U.S. court. Any punishment doled out by website administration is purely to their discretion, so keep that in mind when posting.

 

You're actually partially correct. The first amendment covers freedom of the press, which does step into any electronic medium (within U.S. territory). If you read the disclaimer correctly, you would notice that I put (legally) in parentheses. I wasn't saying YOU CAN NOT BAN US FOR SMACKING JAGEX. Also, FYI this website server is hosted in Texas, so U.S. law applies to this website. ;)

[Azarath]

That big long quote was from a community co-ordinator, Id rather read advice on how to develop the game from someone who has the experience and knowledge to do so.

 

Edit: Like this one:

 

Cons – All the Pros like fun company events, company location, passion for tech etc. are basically a remnant of when someone who actually did something i.e. Gower, a technician himself, created and ran the company. Since the sale to Insight Venture Partners (part of the same ex-Goldman Sachs execs filled cartel that is seemingly buying out half the world nowadays), the company has tanked bad the same way other games they bought like MapleStory have.

 

They haven't made a single game since Gower left. You read that right, 500+ people working for 3+ years straight (with plenty of overtime I might add, for games that have been "around the corner" for all 3 of those years) haven't made so much as a flash clone of space invaders. RuneScape was built solo by Gower and renovated before IVP came in, same with FunOrb. War of Legends was leased from a chinese company, and Ace of Spades was also purchased from outside and mangled.

 

Any work you put in this company, regardless of quality, will be completely useless and thrown away at a whim. Don't ever expect to ever actually come out with a finished product that uses your work. Since the takeover, games like MechScape / Stellar Dawn have been worked on for years then suddenly have the plug pulled on them, throwing all work away on a complete whim. Same with Transformers, after years of work and almost being finished, the incompetent management decides to switch genres on a whim and do the entire game over. Would've been nice if they thought of that before starting, or at least before practically finishing? Deadlines are meaningless and only exist to pressure for overtime.

 

The existing game of RuneScape (Run!Escape, before your kids get addicted to gambling!) has been mangled beyond belief to ruin player experience but churn out as much profit for IVP as possible before the inevitable collapse. It wouldn't be so bad doing pointless work if you got paid well for it, or at least advanced career wise. The pay scale is terrible though and regardless of performance your raises will barely keep up with inflation. Promotions and higher positions are reserved for generic incompetent MBAs and their sycophantic friends that run things without ever having any experience in tech, software or gaming whatsoever. None of these guys have ever written a line of code in anything other than power point in their lives, and none of them will be working the overtime they expect from you, so don't expect any empathy or actual direction. They exist for the sole purpose of self-preservation.

 

Really at this point this is a spoilt-banker owned tech sweat shop, waste time here at your own risk.

Advice to Senior Management – Nothing, because they're not about to fire themselves are they? From their perspectives everything is great as long as they get to leech money off the RuneScape cash cow until it's inevitable death, then move on to the next victim. All with a deeper "management" resume to boot.

Edited February 18, 2014 by Azarath

[NoSouls]

So basically, we more than likely can expect the wilderness to be almost finished and then it to be scratched to make an additional sucky PvP type thing. I think after reading up on that GlassDoor stuff, It's very safe to say that our lovely game will need a casket built. Anyone have level 99 construction irl?

 

This is some other negative talk of Jagex:

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=jagex

http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3026713 [Jagex is/was trigger happy with bans]

http://services.funorb.com/m=forum_fo/forums.ws?13,14,499,105122 [101 Reasons Jagex Sucks]

 

Bafooba11 months agoin reply to pymats

 

they ruin Runescape (even though I never liked it to begin with but for the people who DID they ruined it) They ruin Ace Of spades... a game they bought out... We have reasons to hate them.

 

And of course the typical Jagex denying pretty much every ban appeal: http://www.robotzindisguise.com/forum/showthread.php?6684-GF-Jagex-sucks-They-denied-my-appeal-again-4-years-after-the-offence

 

The way things are running, RuneScape is a very small fire and just ember in some parts. If they don't get more wood, it is going to burn out in my opinion. Jagex needs to do something that I think is impossible or they're going to flop. :P

Edited February 18, 2014 by NoSouls

[Azarath]

Id say whats likely to happen we will stop profting and assets will be sold, and hopefully Andrew Gower will buy the game rights back when it plummets in value.

[NoSouls]

Id say whats likely to happen we will stop profting and assets will be sold, and hopefully Andrew Gower will buy the game rights back when it plummets in value.

 

I like that hopefully statement. It sure would be neat, but I think Gower is occupied with Fen Research and making SolStrike, he is supposed to release an alpha testing of his new game in April some time. I don't think he wants to mess with RuneScape anymore personally. I think he had fun with it and then took off. He doesn't own any of it currently and the way that he totally ditched Jagex, I don't think he will ever go back to Jagex at all. If what you're hoping for is to happen, I believe RuneScape would be taken in under Fen Research and somewhat restored to the good days. The only problem is that I think Fen Research is a much smaller studio (less staff) and I personally think Gower likes that idea. He seems like the type of guy to have a minimum amount of employees make something that would normally take many hundreds. The less workers, the higher salaries for each and the happier both customers and workers are. I think that sounds like the right balance. ;)

[Beret]

JaGeX doesn't suck. They made a game many people still enjoy to play. Simple as that. Just because you don't enjoy the game doesn't mean the creators of the game sucks.

[NoSouls]

JaGeX doesn't suck. They made a game many people still enjoy to play. Simple as that. Just because you don't enjoy the game doesn't mean the creators of the game sucks.

 

Please read the first post and don't reply. ;)

[Fabio]

i like this topic. this one actually makes sense

[O hai im KAMIL]

And of course the typical Jagex denying pretty much every ban appeal: http://www.robotzind...ter-the-offence

 

Maybe if he didn't macro, he wouldn't be permanently banned :]

I had a single mining bot collecting coal at the mining guild and traded like 5k coal to my main account. BAN HAMMER!!